In this episode of You’re Not Crazy, Ray Ortlund and Sam Allberry continue their study of 2 Timothy, emphasizing the strength that comes from the grace of Christ and the importance of passing on the gospel to the next generation.
They highlight the significance of remembering the risen Jesus, which enables pastors to face challenges in ministry with boldness and confidence.
Recommended resource: Confronting Jesus: 9 Encounters with the Hero of the Gospels by Rebecca McLaughlin
Transcript
The following is an uncorrected transcript generated by a transcription service. Before quoting in print, please check the corresponding audio for accuracy.
Ray Ortlund
Hi, I’m Ray ortlund. I’m with my friend Sam alberi. Here, this is your not crazy gospel sanity for young pastors. Welcome back. We’re thinking our way through Paul’s letter to Timothy, Second Timothy in the New Testament. And we’re going to look at how the strength of Christ helps us today to get ready for the next generation we might never meet, but for whom we are essential. And toward the end of our podcast, we’ll circle around to tell you about a fantastic book published by crossway. Written by Rebecca McLaughlin, who is a brilliant writer. We’re so thankful she’s in our generation.
Sam Allberry
Okay, well, welcome back. Ray, it’s good to see you again. How you doing?
Ray Ortlund
I’m doing well. It’s great to be with you. I’m so glad we can do this together.
Sam Allberry
It’s, it’s fun. I really enjoy it. Right. So here’s a question for you. Right? If you could, let’s just say you are someone pays, you’d have a three, four month sabbatical. And you have to use that sabbatical purely to learn a new skill of your choosing just for your own pleasure. What new skill would you want to learn? If you had that opportunity, and someone was going to pay for you that the best kind of instruction you can get? Wouldn’t that
Ray Ortlund
be fun? It would, okay, what I would do is I would take that time in Scotland, and relearn the highland bagpipe, when, which is not your favorite instrument I know. But when we lived in Scotland in the 1980s, the there was a an elderly lady in our village, whose brother was Piper to the Queen up at Balmoral, and Betsey Brown, and she taught me the pipes. And many times, I would sit there in her little cottage on the edge of the village. The only hate in her cottage was a little coal stove, fireplace in her living room, and we would be sitting there trying to keep warm, Listening to the rain pitter patter on the roof above. And she would be chattering away in the Doric, the dialect of Northeast Scotland, which I learned to understand as the years went by. And we had our chanters there, and she would teach me tunes on the chanter, which I could then play on the pipes. And Sam, it was completely and utterly charming. It was like going back in time and experiencing the world of Robert Burns in real life. And I utterly fell in love with Scotland, everything about it, and the pipes are so much fun to play. I was never very good. But I’d love to go back and relearn that.
Sam Allberry
Did you own a set of bagpipes? Yes. Do you still have that set of paper? I gave them
Ray Ortlund
to a friend because
Sam Allberry
because your wife asked you to.
Ray Ortlund
Because I knew what it would in pain it would inflict upon Sam Albury. So it was out of consideration for you.
Sam Allberry
Yeah, you’ve heard me say this before. Oh, but there was a as a British guy who once said the definition of a gentleman is someone who can play the bagpipes but doesn’t.
Ray Ortlund
Oh, painful. Well, Sam, we are in Second Timothy chapter two. What stands out to you?
Sam Allberry
Lots of things. So the theme of enduring seems to permeate the whole section. He gives us three kind of quick fire. analogies of pastoral ministry being a soldier being an athlete, being a farmer, each of those has kind of a long term goal to it. He talks about his own endurance and verse 10. He then talks in verse 12, about our collective endurance if we endure and he opens by by urging Timothy to be strengthened and here’s what I what stands out to me in verse one is it will be so easy to sort of do a pull your socks up, Timothy, come on, get on with it be stronger. But at the very point where he’s wanting Timothy to be strengthened, he’s using very tender language he says you then my child. At the very point he wants Timothy to feel strengthened, he reiterates that fatherly heartfelt love he has for him. And as a reminder that that we’re loved into strength. We’re not browbeaten into strength. And he says be strengthened by the grace that is in Christ Jesus. Yes, Grace strengthens us. Yes.
Speaker 3
If we’re, if we’re weaker, we don’t need
Sam Allberry
you know, some kind of spiritual protein shake, you know, girl type of thing. We We need more of the grace of Jesus that is going to strengthen us. Yes.
Ray Ortlund
And the one sentence that remains in my mind lingers in my mind, and helps me to this day is this one dad said, deliberately reject every strength. That is not of the grace that is in Christ Jesus. Now we pastors of all ages, strengths are being offered to us. Yeah, some of them are, in fact, temptations. And we want to ask the question, this strength that’s being offered to me through this seminar, this new book, whatever is this, of the nature of the grace that is in Christ Jesus? Will this take me more deeply into his grace? Will this translate into greater strength through His grace? If so great, I’m all in, but maybe not. So Paul says, you then my son, here, he’s saying, generation two of this young gospel movement as Paul generation one, hands it off to Timothy, here is the key to your future. be strengthened by the grace that is in Christ Jesus, we can move all our chips over onto that square. Yeah, the grace that is in Christ Jesus.
Sam Allberry
It’s very easy, isn’t it? Even if we have a gospel intention? It’s very easy to trust in a fleshly strength, yes, to get us there. And I’ve, I’ve seen that I felt that that impulse in myself, I’ve seen it in, in other ministries, where we think well, I know I can do this, because I know it will work. I’ll throw my elbows around, I’ll Yes, push my way forward. But because it’s a gospel outcome I’m aiming for therefore it’s okay. Yes. But it just never works that way, does it?
Ray Ortlund
Not that is not faithfulness to the gospel? No, faithfulness to the gospel is is, is richer than that. It’s both doctrinal orthodoxy and pushing forward in the strength that comes from the grace of Christ Jesus, there is. This is strength. That has a sweetness upon it. Yeah. This strength has a reasonableness. It’s not pushy. No, it’s there’s no swagger. Here. There is there’s a resilience,
Sam Allberry
isn’t it? Grace makes us resilient,
Ray Ortlund
well set. So I’m struck that Paul is really defining ministerial success here, in these first three verses. And the first mark is grace as our strength. And then he says, you know, what you’ve heard from me in the presence of many witnesses, entrust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also, the second mark of successful ministry is other people as our goal, not our own grandiosity, her own platform. But looking down into the future, asking the question in the grace of Christ, how can I give the gospel away to as many other people as I possibly can, who then will carry it on into generation three? But this this can’t stop with me. This is not about me.
Sam Allberry
Yeah, that’s fascinating, isn’t it? Because yes, Paul is handing off. This is now the the apostolic, you know, ministry is being you know, this is this is this is a non repeatable moment in church history, because it’s the apostle Yes, preparing for the non apostolic period. But with a, with a principle that is, is taken on by all of us, but I love that idea that Timothy is already being told to get ready for generation three. And you know, in other words, interesting. You, you’re here to make sure the next generation is well set up. Yes. You’re not here to kind of, you know, have all the attention on you to fulfill your ministry dreams or whatever it might be. You’re here to take what I’ve said and to make sure there’s there’s going to be a generation three, I think it was Mark Devere. Our friend Mark Delta who said once from from day one of your installation as a pastor, you should already be preparing. So the succession, preparing that this will be a healthy place for the next guy.
Ray Ortlund
The true test, I believe, of my ministry now is not my ministry now. But those who come after,
Sam Allberry
yeah. Are we setting them up for success? And there are ways of sort of, you know, doing ministry that is great for us, but actually sets people who coming after us up for failure.
Ray Ortlund
So, young pastor, you fulfill your destiny, not by control Rolling or accumulating or enlarging your platform and so forth. But by giving your best away to others, who then will do something maybe even greater with it long into the future, now invisible to you. Trust God with that, and throw your life away into the future.
Sam Allberry
Yeah, it’s that working for fruit that you’re not going to see. But that you don’t need to you don’t need to stick around to see it.
Ray Ortlund
And that’s how much we actually matter. Yeah, far beyond the present moment. So that that’s a mate’s really stands out to me. And then in verse eight, when Paul says, this is almost embarrassing, that he feels he has to say this. Remember, Jesus Christ? Isn’t that Yep. Paul felt he had to say that note to self. Yeah. What what is going on? What is it about us? That we need to be told that?
Sam Allberry
Yeah, well, he’s just given those. Those quick, parallel illustrations of Christian ministry. He’s talked a bit, you know, verse three, sharing the suffering. As a good soldier of Christ Jesus, no soldier gets entangled in civilian pursuits. An athlete has not grown unless he competes according to the rules. It’s the hard working farm who walked out the first show the crops there’s a there’s a proper single mindedness to ministry. A lack of being distracted, a lack of deviation, which I take it as is feeding into verse eight. Remember, remember Jesus Christ, it’s easy, actually, for Jesus Christ to be crowded out by so many other things that are on our plates and calling for our attention, and not to make Jesus the center of all that we’re doing.
Ray Ortlund
John Stott, in his commentary in Second Timothy says, The epitaph over Israel’s grave was, they soon forgot, which is taken from Psalm 106, verse 13, they soon forgot, and start continues even so the church has often forgotten Jesus Christ absorbing itself instead now in barren theological debate, now in purely humanitarian activity, now in its own petty parochial business. Ouch. Yeah, remember Jesus Christ, I remember Shai Linne, preached on those three words at Emanuel church in 2016. I will never forget that verse after Shai preached on it. Remember, Jesus Christ, there’s a three point sermon right there. Remember, Jesus Christ,
Sam Allberry
and the Jesus we are remembering is a one Paul says, risen from the dead, the offspring of David, as preached in my gospel, it’s not just the idea of Jesus that culture has. It is this Jesus, the Jesus, who is in the line of David, and who is now alive and raining. We don’t have the freedom to redefine who Jesus is.
Ray Ortlund
He is the real Jesus, who is actually there. Yeah. And I’m guessing that because Paul is is by grace, strengthening Timothy, stealing his resolve, preparing him helping him setting him up to face pressures, temptations, challenges in the future, risen from the dead. If Jesus was risen from the dead, Sam, you and I can face anything? Yeah, because the resurrection was more than resuscitation. Yeah, the restoring of physical life. I remember S Lewis Johnson at Dallas Seminary back in the 1970s. used to say, the resurrection was the father’s Amen. To the sons. It has finished. So the resurrection was the vindication of Jesus in his life and death. And we are partners in the resurrection. So what every pastor is going to go to the cross 10,000 times in the course of the years, and this is risen. Remember Jesus Christ risen from the dead. That assurance enables us to accept the crosses we must bear go to the cross in the course of ministry, because vindication is inevitable.
Sam Allberry
There was a wonderful Australian pastor and Evangelist called John Chapman who died 1015 years ago, who I remember him giving a tour once he was just a wonderful, vivacious man. But he said once that sometimes he would wake up maybe on the day he’s about to preach with all of those feelings of you know, it’s going to fail. I’m not going to you know, All those negative thoughts that swing through your mind and he said one of the things he would say to himself is Have you received fresh evidence during the night that Jesus didn’t rise again? What a great question. You know what get out of bed and get it get to it then if the graves empty. You know, we can we can get after this.
Ray Ortlund
I love that. I’m so struck I was just thinking this morning I took a screenshot of it to old hymns. Here’s a verse from once to every man in nation, though the cause of evil prosper. Yet his truth alone is strong. Though her portion be the scaffold, and upon the throne be wrong. Yet that scaffold sways the future and behind the dim unknown, stand with God within the shadow, keeping watch over his own. That is us, following Christ crucified and risen again. And then workman of gotta lose not heart by Frederick William Faber. I love this verse, listen to this, then learn to scorn the praise of man, and learn to lose with God. For Jesus won the world through shame and beckons the his wrote, wow, remember Jesus Christ, risen from the dead. Okay. Now we know how to live.
Sam Allberry
Which leads into verse nine for which I’m suffering. Yeah, you can suffer for a reason Jesus, there’s no point suffering for a dead and buried Jesus. And I, verse nine is on my favorite verses in in the New Testament. And that last part of it, you know, poor is bound with chains as a criminal, like, I can’t really imagine what that is physically like. But the word of God is not bound. And, you know, we see that through the book of Acts, every time they try and hinder the work of the gospel. It just spreads. We see that throughout church history. But I find it comforting and helpful for me as I as I adjust to, to life in the US church. Religious Religious freedom is something to cherish and to advocate for and to, to preserve. There’s a lot of fear in the US church that we are about to lose all our religious liberties. There’s, there’s, you know, our friend, David French, has written multiple times, there’s no judicial reason to think we’re about to lose it. But even if we were, verse nine says, that is not the thing to freak out about. The worst thing that can happen to the church isn’t loss of religious liberty. If we will get you know, if everyone’s worst political nightmare happens, and someone is elected, who, you know, leads the charge on having Bible believing pastors arrested. That is not game over for the ministry of the gospel that may actually accelerate the ministry of the gospel. We don’t need to fear such a thing. We shouldn’t long for it either all or provoke it in silly ways. But if the Word of God is not bound, we don’t need to worry about if we ever are. That’s not the worst case scenario. The worst case scenarios is us not being faithful to the gospel. Yes. Not preaching. And as Paul says he has so not that I’m blase about that. I’m sure in the moment, there will be temptations to fear in that situation. But you can’t bind the Word of God, you just can’t. It is always going to continue its journey. And the more people try to bind it, the faster it travels, well.
Ray Ortlund
It is such a privilege to be a pastor and to devote our entire lives to the inevitable glory of Christ. Yeah, we are on the right side of history. Let’s enjoy it. Yeah, we’re
Sam Allberry
not on the right side of human opinion. Yeah. And that isn’t history. Right. So I’m encouraged by that. And Paul takes that into verse 10. Therefore, I undo everything for the sake of the elect.
Ray Ortlund
That’s really strong. I hadn’t seen that connection so directly, and clearly. That’s very helpful, Sam. I endure everything for the sake of the elect. It’s It’s very freeing when my life is no longer We’re about me in the moment. Yeah, what a tiny constricting category that would be, how wonderful I endure everything for the sake of the elect. There is grandeur, in that calling. God has scripted the glory of Christ, in the elect in and through the elect. They are on their way into salvation right now, and they don’t even know it. And God will bring them in into course, my role right now is to keep doing the next right thing by God’s grace for His glory alone. And Paul is saying that that endurance in ministry contributes directly to the salvation of the elect in the future, Sam, I find this very exciting. I believe that my life fallible and ridiculous as I am at times, I am thanks to God’s grace alone, contributing directly to the next great awakening. I may not see it my days, that’s fine with me. I love God’s plan, whatever it is, but, you know, our friend John Piper wrote a wonderful book, don’t waste your life, there is another book that I think God is writing for us. I will not waste your life. You give yourself to me, serve my cause, serve my people go love people, give them the gospel, bring them to Christ and so forth. I will not waste your life you endure everything you will be contributing, as far as Human Instrumentality is concerned, to the salvation of the elect.
Sam Allberry
Yeah. And pose pose use of elect there is, I think significant, because then again, in a context of endurance, that is when the sovereignty of God is such a comfort. Yes. Because, you know, everything may be just going badly, humanly speaking. You know, Paul is there in, in chains. And yet, it’s a competence thing, okay. I am relieved of any burden of trying to figure out who is it who might become a Christian who might not become a Christian. God has those he will save
Ray Ortlund
Yes. And you do something I just delight in. Those converts that are coming, they’re on their way they don’t even know it include the most unlikely, the most improbable. Sam, one of my prayers is that the next great awakening might start inside the porn industry. That the risen Jesus might visit that horrible world with his tender mercies and pull right into his heart. These people who have either been forced into or have thrown themselves into heartbreaking evil, and Jesus will go and touch them with His atoning merit, and put his spirit within them. And they will rise from that death with human magnificence. And the rest of us nice church going people will look at them and say, I want what they have. Yeah. I’d love to be part of that.
Sam Allberry
Yeah, that would be a very, that would be very good for it to happen that way.
Ray Ortlund
And, you know, I believe that we are contributing to that. Yeah.
Sam Allberry
I’m struck as well, you know, I keep forgetting. Paul was the one dragging people off to prison at one point, he was the least likely person you would think would one day be writing these letters to strengthen Christians who are being persecuted by the very same kind of persecution he was championing. And back in Acts Eight, it’s the language used of Paul’s opposition. Paul was ravaging the churches. It’s beastial language. There’s something unhinged and animalistic about it. Yes. Get here he is enduring everything for the sake of the elect, so that they also may obtain the salvation so that there is in Christ Jesus, that those who seem like in fleshly terms, our biggest enemies may well be the very people that are going to be ministering to us and encouraging us down the road
Ray Ortlund
that is so powerful. That consideration Yeah, I’m thinking Sam, and every every young pastor listening, I think we’re all thinking the same thing right now. I revere the privilege of being caught up in that grace. I will give my life to that. Okay, well, Sam crossway books We’re thankful to crossway for their sponsorship of the you’re not crazy podcast. We love those dear friends at crossway Rebecca McLaughlin, who is Just brilliant off the charts has written confronting Jesus nine encounters with the hero of the Gospels. Now, you know, Rebecca, personally is I do
Sam Allberry
yeah, fellow Brit in America. So we’ve we’ve bonded over that. She is both both brilliant and hilarious. So I, I have her new book confronting Jesus. I haven’t read it yet, but I’m excited to, because Rebecca has just a gift for showing me things I thought I already knew, but in such a fresh, vivid, compelling kind of way. Confronting Christianity, her first book was wasn’t is a magnificent book, this is a wonderful follow up. So for those who are thinking, okay, maybe I can’t write off the Christian faith confronting Jesus is, is the book to put in someone’s hands to give them a biblical portrayal of who of who Jesus is, and all the different facets that he reveals himself in. So I’m eager to read it because I’ve everything I’ve read by Rebecca has been, has been wonderful, really, really wonderful.
Ray Ortlund
Now she’s, as I understand it, she’s a PhD from Cambridge, English literature. I think so. Yeah. Amazing. And she’s one of the voices in our generation who like Tim Keller and others, is able to articulate the gospel in categories and in words that really connect with skeptical people today. Yeah. So we recommend Rebecca McLaughlin, confronting Jesus nine encounters with the hero of the Gospels, and Sam and I just want to thank everyone who’s listening. It’s such a thank you for attending to this giving this your your your time. We’re grateful. It’s a privilege to serve you. And we look forward to our next chat together with you listening in thank you for doing so. God bless
In their new book, You’re Not Crazy, Ray Ortlund and Sam Allberry want to help weary leaders renew their love for ministry by equipping them to build a gospel-centered culture in every aspect of their churches. If you’ve benefited from the You’re Not Crazy podcast, we think your church will be encouraged by this book. Pick up a copy of You’re Not Crazy today and receive 30 percent off when you sign up for a free Crossway Plus account.
Ray Ortlund (ThM, Dallas Theological Seminary; MA, University of California, Berkeley; PhD, University of Aberdeen, Scotland) is president of Renewal Ministries and an Emeritus Council member of The Gospel Coalition. He founded Immanuel Church in Nashville, Tennessee, and now serves from Immanuel as pastor to pastors. Ray has authored a number of books, including The Gospel: How The Church Portrays The Beauty of Christ, Marriage and the Mystery of the Gospel, and with Sam Allberry, You’re Not Crazy: Gospel Sanity for Weary Churches. He and his wife, Jani, have four children.
Sam Allberry is a pastor, apologist, and speaker. He is the author of 7 Myths About Singleness, Why Does God Care Who I Sleep With?, , What God Has to Say About Our Bodies, and with Ray Ortlund, You’re Not Crazy: Gospel Sanity for Weary Churches. He serves as associate pastor at Immanuel Nashville, is a canon theologian for the Anglican Church in North America, and is the cohost of TGC’s podcast,You’re Not Crazy: Gospel Sanity for Young Pastors.